Powell Book – Comments

 

By:  Erick Nelson

Last Updated:  October 22, 2003

 

 

 

 

Overall

 

I read the MS twice all the way through, then the third time I yellow-highlighted the things I wanted to mention.

 

There were many interesting points and illustrations that I don’t comment on.  Doesn’t mean that they’re not good.  It does mean that I found nothing to disagree with, though!

 

I want you to work “The Day Jesus Got a Haircut” into the conversation somehow.  That’s my favorite Powell passage. 

 

“A good ending covers a multitude of sins” used to be our motto in my group “Friends”, applied to music.  A great beginning and ending are a must for this.  Use a startling or at least interesting example.”  Wherever possible - Instead of, or in addition to, listing examples, take one illustration and draw it out – either flesh out the example, or use another illustration, or something.  “Don’t tell it, show it.”

 

One thing I noticed is how hard it is to tell the truth and keep it interesting and striking.  The temptation is to come up with a striking Jesse’ Jackson-like phrase and hammer it home.  And then the honesty sets in.  You have to deal with all the “yes-buts”.  And so, truth requires that you explain that this isn’t absolutely the case, and it’s easy to wind up with a death by a thousand qualifications – or at least a loss of power.  “Jesus is present in community!”  (but he prayed alone, and we’re supposed to go in our closet, …)  To really do justice to a lot of these issues, you would have to show all the aspects, facets, and relations, to get the balance just right, etc.  And that takes, if not a whole book, then several chapters, to deal with each one!  And you’re trying (naturally) to summarize.  I for one know that there’s a lot going on behind each statement.

 

 means “extra good – love it - rave reviews.”  Favorite points - usually with two stars! - that made me stop and think and are (I think) life-changing observations:

 

    

Any time I saw something I thought wasn’t exactly true, I questioned it.  Better now than after the book comes out!  A lot of that has to do with the “head vs. heart” issues, which I spoke to in the “Loving God with our Mind” doc.

 

 

 

Introduction – The Poetry of Faith

 

 

Good Points

 

euphemisms for loving Jesus. 

 

not just a regrettable lack of reverence – undermines everything else

 

Love of God/Jesus is not a means to an end – it is the end.  Good to have this clear.

 

The spirit and the heart come together (yes, and the mind, too)

piety = duty, faithfulness

 

If they weren’t pious, they would be judgmental, etc. who didn’t try to love God, rather than judgmental, etc. who do try to love God.

 

Homer Simpson vs. Ned – “we have no reason to expect better of him” – interesting way to put it.  Of course, that’s because Ned claims to be better.

God loved them first – ends the introduction, and later, ends the book.  I like that touch.  On purpose?  I’ll bet it was.  (If not, you should re-think your assumptions about Matthew’s subtle relations being on purpose!)

 

Civil Rights and anti-war leaders, being Christians.  Excellent!  I had that notion, too, but not as strongly.  Now that I look back, that certainly is interesting, and a valid observation.  Our Christianity, at any rate, was against the establishment.  I remember coming to Calvary Chapel one Sunday, and realizing that we had seemingly flipped overnight to a Reagan-loving conservative group!  How did that happen?  I think abortion was a big reason.

 

 

Questions

 

Faith as an umbrella term, including theology and piety.  Sometimes you use “faith” in very different senses – you’re definition later is “basic capacity” for loving God, which is very different than this sense.

 

prose and poetry – the poetry is more unpredictable and surprising.  I kind of agree with you, but see a contradiction.  You also make the point that reality is unpredictable, thus being grounded in the real Jesus opens us to new possibilities.  So then, if prose represents reality adequately, it too will be unpredictable etc.

 

 

Chapter 1 – Naïve Again

 

Good Points

 

I like the biographical information – all of it.


50 or older, Jesus was “getting around” J

 

Dorothy.  J   The difference between …   pretty good.  Hard to express.

 

hippie “wannabes” J

 

Jesus Movement under-estimated.  Absolutely.

 

Jesus freaks – good description.

 

football example – good one, although well-worn.  Well put.  blaming Jesus when things didn’t go right:  I did.  But then, I was the Misfit.

 

Out of the Closet.  I like the educated Jesus Freak image.  I’m glad you came out.  It’s rare than a “real believer” (in my way of thinking) hangs with the crowd you hang with.  I remember the pressure I had from Bill Whedbee at Pomona in my first Bible class, and extrapolate that to the professional world – amazing.  You’re a gutsy dude.

 

Questions

 

Paul Ricoeur – second naivete.  Don’t know what to think about this.  If Borg hadn’t already made use of this – in a huge way – I’d be all for it.  But that’s the point you want to make, and it’s just too bad old Marcus beat you to it.  Don’t know whether you should (a) mention Borg’s use of it; (b) explain more about Ricoeur so we know you’re not just copying Marcus; (c) don’t worry about it.

 

It would be interesting to me, anyway, to see how you’d contrast your naivete with Borg’s.  He seems to feel he’s “coming back home” in a sense, and finding his spirituality – using what he’s learned to be true, but maybe also against what he’s learned (hence the naivete’).  I don’t know how far you want to take the opposition of faith and reason, etc.

 

Kooks and oddballs vs. foolishness of the gospel.  I think that this is partially true – the over-boardness of the thing.  But remember that we were genuinely kooky and odd in ways that are not gospel-conducive.  It’s like Peter’s admonition to “go to jail for Lord, but not for doing bad things” (obviously my paraphrase).  We should be fools for Christ, but not just plain fools!  I think your connection with believing Jesus is alive today is a better illustration.

 

murder of John Lennon?  I don’t understand that connection.  I wouldn’t dispute it though, since all I remember about Chapman was his fascination with Catcher in the Rye.

 

Obsessive Joy.  I have agree with you there.  I knew plenty of people that were just wound too tight.  Me too.  But I also remember my mom telling me “Religion is a good thing, as long as you don’t take it too far.”  There’s something to be said for the 16-30 yr old capacity for absolute dedication, for naivete, for selling out (in the good way), for total FOCUS.  Now I have rival interests and demands – family, job, responsibilities, etc.  I also have less energy.  Which is really better?  Maybe the obsessive joy is “the love I had at first” – I don’t know.

 

Think of this.  Francis of Assisi did his thing in his twenties (I think he died in his early 30’s?)  Jesus hit his stride around 30.  They were obsessed, focused.  Mother Theresa hung in there for lots of years.  How about Brother Lawrence (your excellent example of prayer life)?  He boiled his life down to one thing.

 

Piety – not superior to anybody else’s.  This is the age-old problem of humility and truth.  Does “more genuine” mean “better”?  I don’t think you’d say that every expression of piety is of equal value.  Aren’t there some expressions of piety that are better, or more useful, or more scriptural, than others?  Aren’t you recommending the ones you think really are more useful and better?

 

Opposition of Faith and Reason, Head and Heart.  This needs a whole book.  There is a truth there, that there is a limit to our ability to conceptualize and process, and that our minds are not totally adequate to comprehend Reality.  Only God can do that.  And there are areas of our life that are, not illogical, but a-logical – things that are unrelated to thinking:  pure feeling, etc.  Or things that require logical in the practical sense, but not intellectual prowess.  Too vast a subject to write about here! – but I think it’s good to make explicit.

 

 

Chapter 2 – Sense-able Spirituality

 

Good Points

 

Good title.

 

  Self-projection, wishful thinking, rather than engagement with anything that is real.  Good point, made throughout.  Stars for the whole chapter. 

 

believe in a God that they find fashionable.  Well put.  “What do I want God to be like?” as opposed to “What is God really like?”

 

not challenging.  Good.  (But it goes beyond that. Right now, I’m not looking for challenging spirituality, so that’s not automatically a selling point!  The deeper issue is that a made-up God is going to let you down – big time – sooner or later.)

 

pick certain parts of the Bible  J

 

the idea that people who have “lost their faith” simply discovered that their imaginary God wasn’t there.  Good point.

 

Grounding spirituality in external reality.  Good lead-in, and excellent point.

 

Jesus is a figure of historical record.   J   Post-Easter Jesus is the Pre-Easter Jesus.  We discover Jesus’ personality in the N.T.  People wrote down what he said and did.  Puts limits on fabrication!

 

Spirituality that relies on vagueness to fill in the blanks! 

 

not “imaginary playmate”

 

   Jesus is not what we would have invented.  Therefore not as immediately appealing as the home-made inventions!  (contra Crossan’s “good news”  - something congenial to the reader that always changes with the times!)

 

 

Chapters 3 and 4

 

Already covered in my response regarding “Jesus in our hearts.”  Lots of good points, though, especially the points community.

 

 

 

Chapter 5 – Presence and Absence

 

Good Points

 

Loving Jesus is different from loving figures of the past.  It’s not just that.  And more than believing things about him.

 

   These things don’t love us back!!  Excellent. 

 

Resurrection means is alive.  Means he can be present.  Not just symbolic, not just imaginary.

 

Thomas Jefferson.  Good example.

 

Reality surprises me. 

 

    Absence.  Don’t they miss him?  Like being in love with someone who has gone away.  … and like someone who you expect to return any minute!    Jesus’ absence in communion.  Never thought about it before.  Excellent!

 

Luther – theology of glory.

 

We are in love with the bridegroom who has gone away.  Strong ending.

 

Questions

 

Resolving the contraction – or learning to live with the ambiguity:  why should the ambiguity remain?  You resolve it yourself.  You say “on one level”, but that seems be the whole answer.  Nothing mysterious here.  He is going away.  He is with us in one sense (experientially, spiritually), and not in another sense (physically) – which is much different than being simply absent.

 

“Christians should be sad.”  Possibly over-stating to make the point.  I can be happy and sad at the same time, for different reasons.

 

“a little while” – I always thought he was talking about the period between his crucifixion and resurrection.  I think your basic point is great, just this example may not apply ?

 

“We have to hold the two together.”  Yes, by resolving the paradox.

 

 

Chapter 6 – Waiting for the Trumpet

 

Good Points

 

constant restlessness. 

 

  Interpretation – what it would have meant to first-century readers (first), then (second) general application.  “We yield to the intent of scripture …”

 

  The whole point about “expectation” vs. “belief” – basically, the whole chapter’s point.

 

  Apprehension of the second coming uses images, symbols, metaphor, myth, etc – but this doesn’t mean that the event is imaginary or only symbolic.  That’s because of the limitations of reason vis a vis the “greater world”.

 

when Paul laid his head on the chopping block.  good point and example J

 

Questions

 

I don’t know if the “expectation” vs. “belief” distinction, which I think is correct, commits us to a non-“rational perspective”.  You bring up good arguments, like Paul’s expectation, like the lack of difficulty for the early Christians with the fact that the Lord hadn’t come back, what James expected his readers to understand – stuff like that. 

 

Your whole argument for distinguishing between the common arguments for Jesus’ return and the proper interpretation of the text is entirely rational, and proper.  So, I think the “expectation” is theology, the prose of faith – the application, the anticipation, all that is the poetry.

 

 

 

Chapter 7 – A Flicker in Time

 

Good Points

 

“everything happens for a reason” – doesn’t help.   – too pat.

 

  It is simplistic (irrational) to take Bible verses that speak of one kind of suffering and apply them to every kind.  (I am a sucker for logical points like this.)

 

  Sometimes suffering serves a purpose – but not God’s.  Not everything that happens is God’s will.  The devil.

 

leash appears to be a long one.  Indeed.  J

 

  I guess if this were all the evidence I had to go on, I would have to agree with you.  Again, excellent.  “The wisdom of that response lies in its reluctance to claim more than can be known.”

 

  “The universe is broken and needs repair.”  There is a problem, it will be fixed – not by us, but by the creator.  Well said, too.

 

Why doesn’t God fix it now?  Good restraint in leaving that open. 

 

bodies – I also look forward to trading up.  Tell me about it.  J

 

Or, actually, that’s not it, because the Bible says …  Things that no one has ever seen or heard or even thought about – what has never entered into the imagination of any human being – that the Bible says, is what God has prepared for those who love God.  Well put.

 

Knowing how it ends.  Good points.  My example is a basketball game.  If you knew your team was going to win in the end (maybe you’re watching it on tape), being behind by 20 points at half time wouldn’t faze you a bit.  Same for this life – if you know it ends with victory, all the rest is just bumps along the road.  (easier to articulate than to feel, sometimes)

 

Questions

 

“we know certain things about the future, and we know these things for certain.”  I don’t think we know these things with 100% infallibility.  It’s only probabilistic knowledge, but that’s all we have to work with, being human and all.

 

 

Chapter 8 – Already and Not Yet

 

Good Points

 

Jesus’ works of powers were “signs” (true!) that God was in charge and interested in human affairs.  Choice shows (wide) scope of the plan.

 

  The Imprisoned Tyrant.  Good explanation.  Hadn’t thought of it quite this way before.*

 

Chart of the Ages.  Never saw this before either.  Probably don’t get out enough.  Looks right to me.  “It is the overlap that makes life confusing.” Nice point.

 

Questions

 

Is Already vs. Not Yet a contradiction?  Certainly not.  You resolve it pretty well, here.

 

You mention that the devil uses “trickery”, which is very true.  I think it’s more this trickery, along with temptation, rather than fear and intimidation, that gets us to do his bidding.  A small point.

 

 

Chapter 9 – Baptism and Death

 

Good Points

 

Evils in pairs.  Reminds me of Aristotle.  He makes every virtue a intermediary point between opposite vices.  The “golden mean”, the right balance and proportion.  It’s foundational to Aristotle’s ethics, which is foundational to lots of things in philosophy.

 

The Dangers of Enthusiasm.  I can picture it.  J

 

  How is death like baptism.  Interesting and informative treatment.

 

Removing barriers.  Didn’t know about the temple curtain representing the sky.

 

 

Questions

 

Removed in baptism, removed at death.  I always substitute “conversion” for baptism when I read this stuff, because it avoids a bunch of baptism issues.  But that’s ok.  I don’t know what to make of this whole argument; it’s kind of foreign to me.  Which is probably good.

 

 

 

Chapter 10 – Jesus is for Losers

 

Good Points

 

  Great title.  Our pastor actually had that in his sermon, just like that, a couple of weeks ago.  Must be right.  Anyway, I can relate! 

 

We believe in grace, but we don’t really “get it.”  Very, very true.

 

Disciples never get anything right.  Especially in Mark.  I remember reading something that says Mark’s gospel reads pretty naturally as personal reminiscences of Peter (if you change the pronouns around); and that it’s Peter’s realistic (i.e. humble) view of the disciples that comes across.  Worshipful followers would never make that up.

 

  Jesus is real.  Therefore not smooth, clean – ups and downs, etc. annoyed and angry, etc.  (for me – one way I know he’s talking to me for real is that he so often says what I would not say to myself; it’s like running up against a brick wall; very real)

 

Judas – “sell out and escape” with a modest profit.  You know, it never occurred to me that Judas saw what was coming and got out while he could.

 

  No one ever volunteers to be a disciple.  They reject him.  Jesus never gives up on them.  “Why didn’t Jesus rise from the dead angry?" Why wasn’t ditching him in his hour of need ‘the last straw’?”  Well put. 

 

Something happens or doesn’t happen and we realize what a sham this all is (our self-righteousness).

 

It’s got everything to do with Jesus and nothing to do with you – based entirely on his faithfulness.  (But don’t get hyper-Calvinistic on me.)

 

We’re not buddies:  physician/patients, Savior/sinners.

 

Questions

 

Coming to faith, believing in Jesus, has made them worse people.  I think there’s a sense where this is true, but as stated I don’t think it’s true.  I think that the events intensified and just showed the character they had all along.  I don’t think anybody would believe for a minute that the disciples – before they met Jesus – would have behaved any better under the circumstances.  They would have resisted the path of suffering (get thee behind me, Satan); they would have argued over who was the greatest, and they certainly wouldn’t have stood there and let the Romans capture them.  It’s not that they really became worse people under Jesus’ influence.  It’s that he led them into the Major Leagues when they were high school baseball players at heart. 

 

It’s also important to note that Jesus didn’t have them for years and years.  What – three years tops?  It wasn’t until the resurrection that everything got pulled together for them.  It’s probably true that they didn’t demonstrably improve during that (brief) time – that they were still the same knuckleheads they always were, which is enough to prove your point.

 

 

 

Chapter 11 – People of Little Faith

 

 

Good Points

 

“Ye of little faith” – I understand that the Greek literally means “little-faiths” – so Jesus said “Oh, you littlefaiths”. 

 

People of great faith.  Interesting.

 

   “Can’t ever be too dumb or pathetic for Jesus” – well put, and a great point.

 

Spiritual growth – how we live our lives; absolutely.  People who don’t want their lifestyle called into question – tough luck!  “Bedrock, spiritual truth.”  I remember one day, as I was saying this to Christopher, who was saying “I love you, Daddy”:  “If you love me, why don’t you do what I tell you to do?” – I realized that this is what God means. 

 

I like the way you end the chapter.  Reminds me of good old C.S.L.

 

Questions

 

Synoptic Problem.  I don’t think it’s necessary to introduce.  You can look at Matthew’s, Mark’s, and Luke’s tendencies and emphases without any assumption one way or the other about dependencies.

 

“He never actually says that there is anything wrong with this.”  Well, he kind of implies it “Why did you doubt?” is pretty close to the exasperated “How long must I put up with you?”  In Peter’s case, “You were so close! – you could have made it!”  True, he doesn’t give them a remedy, at least not there.  But I think he was genuinely disappointed, and implies that they should have had more faith.

 

Mustard seed.  Using the faith that you have.  True.  But I think the idea is that even this (to Jesus) tiny amount of faith can be useful.

 

Faith cannot grow.  I have never thought about this, or heard this mentioned before.  Don’t know what to think of it.  If “faith” means believing things, at least for one “sense” of faith, then I think you’re wrong.  But if faith is understood (as you are careful to define it) as a “basic capacity”, we might have a “given” basic capacity for trust in general at birth.  But that changes with experience, I’d think.  I don’t know if any general truth can be stated about how easy or hard it is to trust God (in a basic sense), over time.  “Trusting God” … to do what?  After going through the school of hard knocks, I have to conclude that the level of financial provision I’m guaranteed is pretty low indeed (the martyrs weren’t even guaranteed that).  Somehow, God’s provision seems to work better when I have a job.

 

Increase in understanding.  The link between “understanding” in this sense (which, true, is not the same as scholarship) is not as simple as being virtually identical to obedience.  They are cross-dependent, etc., but clearly not the same thing.  The point of “have you understood all of this?” is not “have you gone out and done this”, or “will you commit to doing it”, but simply “Did you get what I’m saying?”

 

Teaching people to have faith.  Depends on the meaning of “faith.”  In the plain sense, I think removal of specific doubts would count as increasing faith.  The whole “loving God with our mind” thing.  But that’s been discussed.

 

True, God did not chose the “wise” but the foolish, etc. – so that people wouldn’t think this was something that people had figured out on their own, and that the smarties wouldn’t lord it over the rest of us.  And, true, Jesus chose the non-scholars to be the core twelve.  But …

 

“… it is not linked to the intellectual processes of human reasoning that we might associate with highly educated persons today.”   I don’t buy this completely.  See Loving God with Our Hearts.

 

Also, God did choose Paul to be his number one spokesman.  And Paul was both intelligent and educated.  Also, Nicodemus and Joseph of Arimathea were Pharisees, right?  Probably on the educated side of the curve.  Apollos, and Priscilla and Aquila, seems to have been pretty smart.  And a little later, Justin Martyr and Irenaeus, too. 

 

 

Chapter 12 – Easter Ambiguity

 

Good Points

 

  Fear and Joy – Yes, every time an angel appears, he has to soothe the person with “don’t be afraid.”  The numinous breaks in, and it’s big-time joy, which has a large element of awe (“fullness” of joy), not “shallow” joy.  Aslan is not tame!

 

Worship is consistent with doubt.  Very true.

 

The Pharisees were certain about everything.  Interesting point.

 

  The overconfident are liable to be those who have a relationship with an imaginary God (figment) – pesky problems of fear and doubt are perhaps a sign of our dealing with reality.  I agree.

 

Questions

 

“Mature piety, it seems, lies in the reconciliation of elements that are often thought to be irreconcilable.”  True!  It’s the reconciliation we’re after.  It’s the understanding that arises from dealing with the paradox.  That’s what makes it, in the long run, clear and consistent.  But you turn around and say the opposite – “I figured the confusion would lessen …” and haven’t discovered that to be true. 

 

I suppose we start out with a child-like consistency, and then have to deal with more complex issues, and the answer is not to throw up our hands and say “irreconcilable, it’s just too ambiguous”, but to plunge ahead and try to resolve it.  Second naivete is in that second-level clarity!

 

[Love] is by nature ambiguous.  Loving God … means embracing that ambiguity.”  Yes, if and only if “embracing” doesn’t mean leaving it ambiguous, but in trying to resolve it.  Yes, embracing both sides, but they are not really contradictory, just different in specifiable ways.

 

Worship and Doubt.  I don’t know about the examples.  First, the resurrection account – I know that this is a very compressed narrative, excerpts of what happened.  I’m not sure what the “some doubted” means, and I don’t think it’s necessarily implied that Jesus’ commission was to the doubters.

 

Second, I don’t think that Matthew put a lot of thought into some of the similarities that people find.  It’s like when I look at the Misfit album lyrics, I find a lot of eerie coincidences, almost like I had written Stand, for instance, knowing the details of all the other songs.  But it wasn’t conscious like that at all.  As a point of fact, it was just that I have certain tendencies, and so you see common themes.  (Which brings up points that God might have had in mind that Matthew was unaware of.) 

 

As far as this actual coupling of stories, I’m sure the disciples would have worshipped just as fervently if Peter had made it all the way across. 

 

I do agree that worship is compatible with doubt, but not that they are inherently paired up.  You do raise the caveat that doubt is not essential to worship.

 

Pharisees – I think the point is one of humility, rather than arrogance.

 

“… Jesus never rebukes anyone for it.”  I think that Jesus does rebuke people for doubting.  “Why did you doubt?”

 

“Where we are weak, God is strong” – this is a tricky passage and I think easily could be misinterpreted.  Then we should be as stupid as possible, and sin a lot too, so that God won’t be hampered by our competence.  That’s not the meaning.  So, any time somebody brings this up, I think that it has to be defined carefully. 

 

 

Chapter 13 – Sunday Morning

 

Good Points

 

    “Do you love Jesus?” … “You would die for him, but you won’t be bored for him?”  Just sit there for one hour, being bored.  Do it for him.  Call it “bearing your cross” if you like.  Just do it.  Waste an hour on Jesus – and see what happens.   “ … all for the one you love.”  Great.

  

  Church isn’t about us, it’s about the Lord.  Great example, David’s Eagle scout ceremony.  Nobody said “I didn’t get much out of that.”

 

The handbell choir comment.  Good.

 

Jesus freak example.  Very good advice.

 

  Pray to the God you don’t believe in.  Even though I think there’s more to it (get questions answered, etc.), this is always great, great advice.  (I remember Barry McGuire saying he used to be mad at God for not existing.)  Ask, search and knock!

 

Come to be found.  J

 

Questions

 

In addition, I think going to church weekly is Making a Stand.  Why does God have to honored in exactly that way?  Because we need to gather together (ecclesia), and make a stand together.

 

 

Chapter 14 – Hearts and Treasures

 

Good Points

 

    Treasure – most people get the point backwards.  I always did!  Never thought of it this way.  Good stuff.  Put your treasure where you want your heart to (someday) be!

 

    Premeditated contact with the divine that is both intense and intentional – of keeping an appointment with God.  Well put.

 

If you commit to ½ hour a day and only do it three times a week, that’s better than you would have done.

 

Going through the motions.  There is some value in faithfulness.

 

Questions

 

I don’t know about “giving from the heart”, but I remember they used to quote “God loves a cheerful giver”, and if people couldn’t give cheerfully they could just go buy a big Mac instead.  Actually, it was kind of disarming, that the guy wasn’t (explicitly at least) going for the cash.

 

Even with the obvious caveats (“other causes”), I wouldn’t necessarily stress giving to the church.  I benefited, when very poor, from a couple who gave to specific individuals who they knew needed money.  They would save up for a month, and then lay it on somebody (once it was me).  I’ve done that, too.

 

 

Chapter 15 – Something to Savor

 

Good Points

 

Bible as “delicious” J

 

Judas went out and hanged himself.  J  I remember a guy who accidentally turned to the scripture “You shall go out with joy” and decided God was telling him to date a girl named Joy.  I believed at the time, and circumstances confirmed it, that he was exactly the person to stay away from.

 

Child sacrifice, killing Philistines – good point.

 

Personal devotions – you can do whatever you want to.

 

  God knows your hearts.  If you don’t believe, don’t pretend that you do.

 

  We don’t worship the Bible.  It doesn’t love us!  It’s a means to an end.

 

Questions

 

“When we use the Bible for personal devotions, we use it in a way that was never intended.”  At first I thought you meant “for devotions”, implying that the gospels and epistles, for instance, weren’t written with the foresight that they’d be picked apart and meditated upon.  But you are emphasizing that it’s not (expressly) for personal devotions, but communal use.  But how can you “meditate both day and night” on the Law, or the Psalms, without doing so on an individual basis? 

 

So I agree that there is a communal intent, but it’s too strong to say it was “never intended” to be used for personal devotions.

 

 

Chapter 16 – Talking to God

 

Good Points

 

Don’t be embarrassed if you don’t know how to pray.

 

  Conversation with God. – in an honest, vulnerable way.  Childish, silly, wrong things are ok.  No loving parent would be strict about this stuff.  (one reason to pray in secret)  Experiment.  Enjoy.  If you are mad at God, tell him!  Boy, I’ve done that.  Feels good, too; and sometimes I’ve gotten answers that way.

 

We begin by wanting God to give us what we desire and we end by desiring what God wants to give.  Very good.

 

Miracles.  Inappropriate for God to do them for cavalier reasons.  (but cavalier is in the eye of the beholder, I suppose)

 

  Ok to ask for anything (Corvette).  Pity the person for whom these are never even issues at all.  Sometimes we ask for rocks and he gives us bread.

 

  Prayer is an arena for encountering God and learning what kind of God we have!  Yes!

 

Many times God answers our prayers within the normal laws of the universe. 

 

God does not take orders from us.

 

   Great example – the kid in the store.

 

Questions

 

Jesus’ own disciples (and John’s) didn’t know how to pray.  Well, in a sense, ok – if they thought they had it down, they wouldn’t have asked.  But I don’t think this means they didn’t ever pray (legitimately) before they met Jesus.  Religious teachers had their own spin and methods; and they were trying to find out what Jesus’ “new and improved” techniques might be.

 

Miracles – expecting and demanding.  Depends on what we mean by “expecting”; if that has a tinge of “demanding”, then that’s not good.  If it’s “eagerly anticipating”, like we do with Jesus’ coming, maybe that’s good.

 

Praying for parking spaces, etc.  I’m not sure that praying for success at various things is necessarily a zero sum game.  Maybe the way God gives me a parking space is not to deny it to someone else, but to encourage somebody to leave shopping early to spend more time with their kids, or not go shopping at all that day – whatever.  Publishing contracts – there is no set number of contracts possible; depends on finances.  But good point about it’s ok to ask!

 

 

Chapter 17 – A Strange Seque

 

Good Points

 

  Elisha example.  Try going to church, reading Bible, praying – the “easy”, normal stuff.

 

  Brother Lawrence.  You’ve gotta love that guy.

 

Emptying and filling the mind.  Philippians “whatever is true”, etc.  Let them roll through your mind, but slow them down and think about each one; try concentrating on the spaces between your thoughts … silences between sounds.  Very interesting.  My mind is too noisy for that.  Need practice.

 

Listen for an answer.  The best practical advice I ever got was Father Harriot – “When you want to be a weight lifter, you don’t start out with 400 lb weights.  You start with the smaller ones and work up.  Start by asking God yes/no questions, and say ‘I think you are saying Yes.  If that’s really from you, please bring it out stronger; if not, take it away’ – and see what happens.”

 

Good balance – on one hand “Thus says the Lord” <> “Thus says me”; on the other, don’t get paralyzed about it.

 

  Martha would only be able to respond, “I don’t know.  I had a lot to do that day”  well put.

 

Serving the Lord vs. letting him serve you.

 

  The mission of the church is to love Jesus Christ; everything else is just strategy.  Eminently quotable.

 

Reluctant to prioritize spiritual matters.  Right on.  Love God (with mind, too), love neighbor. 

 

 

 

Chapter 18 – For the World

 

Good Points

 

People who enjoy God seem to enjoy life.  (I need to do that more.)

 

Gnostic influences persist today.  Indeed J  Disengaging from the world.

 

  Jesus – the fact of Jesus.  I won’t spit back details - the whole point is very well made!  Good distinction between “the world (the pre-Christian world-view, system)” and “the world” (God’s created order and all it contains).  (To refuse this gift is to reject the giver, isn’t it?)

 

Nice defense of “hat would Jesus do?”– connecting it with Imitation of Christ.

 

Suffering for others.  “Love hurts” – but now in a new way.  Love means reaching out, rejection, hurting with loved ones who hurt, going out of our way – an entire book worth.

 

Questions

 

Tiny point about John the Baptist not liking people much.  True, he seems austere, even crabby.  But the material is too sketchy to draw any conclusions either way.  Argument from silence.

 

 

Conclusion – The Great Truth

 

Good Points

 

God Loves You.  When Christopher was little, I realized I loved him way more than I expected to.  I was amazed by it.  I wondered if other dads felt like that.  One day I realized that this is kind of like what God feels towards me!  I always accepted that he “loved” me, but probably not that he delights in me like that!  Very cool.  We learn about God’s love from being in love relationships, don’t we?

 

“Truth withstands ignominies of packaging.”  I can’t actually say this sentence, but it’s very good.

 

Grace reduced to pity.  Good thought.

 

  God loves us because he has made us (and re-made us) lovely and loveable.  Whole point is excellent.  “Humans – humanity – humanness … it was all God’s idea in the first place.” 

 

He “loves us first” is a good ending.